Sand Hill Road Host Scott McGrew spoke with Larry Gadea, CEO and founder of Envoy, to learn more about his early days at Twitter, now known as X, and Google and what led him to make the entrepreneurial jump.
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WATCH HEREAn auto-generated transcript of this episode is below. Please excuse any typos and grammatical mistakes.
0:08: We would literally have FBI agents show up and they'd be like, OK, we need to like lock down these accounts and like investigate because they threatened such and such.
0:17: And, and then we'd just be like, oh yeah, yeah, you probably want to talk to like the support people.
0:21: they, the FBI goes in to get the left door over there.
0:24: I think the CIA is on the right.
0:26: Entrepreneur Larry Gadilla describing the early days of Twitter.
0:30: He's now the CEO of Envoy.
0:33: They make systems to check you in at the office.
0:36: More about Twitter and his time at Google as a teenager coming up this week on Sand Hill Road.
0:47: All right, so, we'll start with, are you familiar with the Forbes 30 under 30?
0:53: Yeah, yeah, no, no, it's keep going.
0:55: Yeah, I don't know why they keep doing that.
0:57: So you were, I mean, it was a few years ago, but you were one of Forbes 30 under 30.
1:00: So just, you know, for archival purposes, if you end up in prison, Is there something you would like me to play back, you know, of your recording?
1:10: Right, right.
1:11: I didn't do it.
1:13: I was, I was being thoughtful the entire time.
1:16: they don't know what they're talking about.
1:18: I will appeal.
1:20: We were, we're going to figure this out.
1:22: It's not as it sounds.
1:25: OK, so there's a cachet to to landing the right investor.
1:29: we'll, we'll talk about what your business does in a second, but I want to talk about the investments as being a, a venture, venture capital podcast.
1:37: People tend to think, you know, if, if he convinced the firm X to invest, he's on to something.
1:42: So that's, that's certainly true of Andries and and we'll talk about that.
1:45: But Angel investor Elid Gill is an investor as well.
1:48: That impressed me because Elid can really pick the good ones.
1:52: I hope.
1:52: So, I hope so.
1:53: Clearly, if, if you invest, we're good, right, that's how this works.
1:57: No, it's, it's, so I know a lot from, from Twitter, like Twitter, I, I joined Twitter when we were like 40 people or something and, and we acquired this company, maybe like a couple, 1 or 2 years into that.
2:07: , and, and it was, he's just like a, a thoughtful guy and like it's, it's very analytical, very down to earth.
2:14: There's no, there's no show with a lot.
2:17: You just get the real deal.
2:20: and yeah, I maintain that relationship over time.
2:23: obviously he, he invests like an institution these days, so we were obviously doing our series C.
2:29: It's well past a, like what what you'd normally take on as, as like you don't really bring in angels in these kinds of rounds, but,, again, a lot is like an institution and, and yeah, we, we talked a lot about strategy and everything and in the end it was just like, hey, let's do something.
2:45: So I was very excited we could still get on folks like him.
2:48: As far as Andries, you said once that you were afraid of venture investor, Chris Dixon from, yeah, wow, I wonder where this come from, from you.
2:59: Of course.
2:59: Yeah, you said it once, or at least I read that you said it once.
3:02: What, what were you afraid of?
3:04: I don't know.
3:04: I mean, he's tall and he's like very deep voice.
3:07: I mean, there's all these like human characteristics, but no, look, it's it's a guy that's highly accomplished.
3:12: He knows what's up.
3:13: He, he's picked a very interesting and very rigorous market that he's in right now, especially with all the crypto stuff and And a guy gets it and, and he knows what's going on.
3:23: So it's afraid isn't quite the right word.
3:26: I would say that that's like, it's just, I don't know, you're, you're, there's a lot of respect that goes out there and, and it's like, yeah, I'll I'll do whatever is necessary for the guy.
3:35: And one of your biggest investments comes from Brookfield.
3:37: That makes a lot of sense because they're in real estate.
3:39: Yeah, that's what they do.
3:40: I mean, they, they own operate a whole bunch of buildings all around the world.
3:44: They have all sorts of subsidiaries that do different parts.
3:46: To that, but it's also a great way to get easy access to a bunch of buildings, a bunch of protocols, all these building managers, the dynamics of, of how real estate operates.
3:56: Like we obviously build workplace products for, for offices and for companies, and, and like manufacturing and all that, but the real estate industry is very different from just being a tenant somewhere.
4:08: So it's, they've been very, very helpful in, in just kind of.
4:12: Educating us on, on, on how these things operate and also they've introduced us to a bunch of buildings.
4:17: We've worked with those building managers to figure out, hey, how can we help you operate this entire thing?
4:22: How do we take you forward a few years because all these buildings are using software from like 20-30 years ago and and we're trying to kind of be like the the reinvention for them and and everybody else.
4:34: In fact, when when I greeted you in the lobby, you took a special note and I'm sure you note.
4:38: In every lobby, how we do it and it was a it was a paper guest book like like a Vermont Airbnb.
4:44: I mean, I like to think of NBC as being pretty technology forward, but we still have the the paper guest book.
4:50: Yeah, yeah.
4:50: I mean, look, it's it's it's not uncommon.
4:52: It still happens today.
4:54: it all depends on like compliances and all that kind of stuff that companies have.
4:58: obviously a paper log book in in some scenarios is totally fine.
5:01: In other ones, it's like totally not OK.
5:03: There's all.
5:04: All sorts of things.
5:05: I always look back to see, see that's the thing, that's exactly it.
5:08: This is actually one of the basis of I was, I was talking with a reporter a long time ago and then he was like, it's really awesome when I get to like sign a paper logbook because I get to see if all my competitors have been there before me and if they have, I kind of can like sneak in something about, well, look, it's, it's like not exactly an exclusive now, is it?
5:30: And it's like I know those guys, so it's, it's the paper logbook is is loved and hated by by lots, but at the end of the day, I mean, look, it's, it's, it's a very easy way of doing something and we try to, but, but it also can't do stuff like looking up on, on some kind of FBI list or or looking up a background check on somebody if they're like a foreign national.
5:51: That we, we work with all sorts of companies that are, are in manufacturing.
5:55: They're from different countries.
5:57: We need to look up the live calls need to be made to the FAA to double check that, hey, this person's on this like no fly list.
6:04: Are they allowed in a department of defense contracting, ITAR regulated facilities so it gets really sophisticated really quickly.
6:11: When you stop thinking about tech and more about like the rest of the world, which is the majority of our customers you're clearly solving a problem, and but what made this the problem you wanted to solve?
6:23: Yeah, it's, well, look, I, I, so I was at Google at 2005 to 2009 and then I started at Twitter when again when when we're pretty small, it's like 40 people in 2009.
6:33: And what's interesting there is just like the massive contrast of when a company has a lot of people and really smart people, which is Google, and when a company has a very few amount of people still smart but very few amount of people and Twitter was very, they didn't have these people would just be walking around and like we would literally have FBI agents show up and they'd be like, OK, we need to like lock down these accounts and like investigate because they threatened such a.
6:58: And such and and then we just be like, oh yeah yeah yeah you probably wanna talk to like the support people.
7:04: the, the FBI goes in like the left door over there.
7:06: I think the CIA is on the right and it's, it's just like we just have these kinds of ridiculous situations, but it just got me thinking as the company got bigger, so I was there when we were like 40, we grew about 1500 in the three years I was there.
7:20: that's fast growth, but it's also what happens is you hire a lot of great people.
7:24: Oddly enough, people were starting to build a lot of the tools that Google had internally, a visitor sign in things on meeting rooms, things to keep track of reservations, things to like have an office map.
7:35: And what happened is like I was like, wait, wait, whoa, what we're just building these in-house and it turns out that Google, Facebook, Apple, all these other companies all just built the same things over and over and over again.
7:46: So it's, it's kind of like, huh, maybe we should do this.
7:50: And, and then by we I mean maybe I should start a company that only does these kinds of tools because it's clear that once the companies get big enough, they just inherently start building it themselves anyway so might as well give them the the the latest greatest technology and things and that's essentially it's too in the sense that if I go and I visit one company and you know it it does everything automatically, maybe there's a quick sign in with the QR code.
8:16: , it gets me to the person I need to, to get to and there's a map.
8:20: I come back to my company and say, you know, all these problems, I did a thing over at Intel or whatever, actually you do what Pandora and Yelp and GoPro and I was over it, you know, I was over at Yelp and and they do it this way and this seems like a much better way.
8:36: No, that that's exactly if we do it right, so, so there's like a caveat there.
8:39: If we do it right and people like it, it is.
8:42: and it will grow.
8:44: I mean, talk about like the product minded engineers like dream kind of growth method where it's highly merit-based, the better it is, the more people like it, the faster it grows like there's nothing more you could ask for.
8:56: there's no kind of, yeah, so, so it's, I was very excited about that and honestly that was the plan originally from the get go.
9:04: The reason we do the visitors product is because it has an inherent viral distribution.
9:08: , I'm also just like an engineer and like just generally don't like, starting everything with like trying to talk to people.
9:16: So it's kind of like how can I build software to get my way out of this.
9:19: Now, obviously over time I've had to adapt, but it's, it's just like it's great to see kind of merit drive product adoption.
9:26: and then these days now it's employees that are using it.
9:28: It's employees that are like, huh, this is a really great product for my workplace.
9:32: Like I use it for desking, I use it for rooms.
9:34: I use it to find parking, I use it for.
9:35: Events and and now they're hopefully recommending it to their future employer but it's a little less than than the visitors.
9:42: You raised C pandemic, so I suppose that shows that your investors are are convinced people are coming back.
9:50: Yeah, yeah, and also we figured something out during the pandemic.
9:53: Well, that was gonna be my follow up question.
9:55: So yes, number one, it it seems that everyone is confident people are coming back to the office.
9:59: If you're raising money for for an office product essentially.
10:03: But tell me about when you realized as a guy who has a business welcoming visitors into an office that you heard on the radio or the TV or on Twitter, people weren't gonna come into the office anymore.
10:19: Right?
10:19: , look, it's it's, it's always been a bit of denial from everyone.
10:23: I mean, even in early.
10:24: COVID days, people would, would like, oh yeah, we're going back next week.
10:28: Oh yeah, maybe in like 2 weeks, maybe in a month.
10:29: OK.
10:30: In September when the kids are back in school in in January because it's a new year and it's like all these kind of kind of random reasons that that didn't really happen but did for some companies.
10:41: So, just generally people were, were thinking they're going to go back.
10:45: , it helped a lot.
10:46: Like our, our products during the pandemic were less about visitors and it was more about employees.
10:50: It's about how do you keep employees kind of safe-ish in an environment where there's COVID running around.
10:56: Like some people had these terrible situations at home where they'd be just like these kids crying, there's like people running around, and, and all that.
11:07: Like that, I remember that one video with like the this was even before the pandemic where the guy was like on on the news and like yeah, the BBC and like the kid comes in with like the whole spaceship as crawl, yeah, no, that's just like totally normal now and in fact actually it's desirable, but regardless, it's.
11:25: That kind of world like we needed to, the companies are recognizing that this is not the right thing, especially in, in, and fast forward to now like the environment that we're in is one that really needs a lot more thoughtfulness and in execution.
11:41: I, I just, I, I see company after company that's like not doing so hot, like there's still like a lot of like.
11:47: , employee stuff and there's a lot of like just not growth and what happens is, is these companies are, are not solving their hard problems.
11:55: So, I, I applaud companies for kind of doing the hard things, but I also think that companies need to be very clear that they that that is their intention.
12:04: when you bring people back in, it's obviously not wonderful for, for a lot of them because they have to do these commute.
12:08: And, and it's like you got to deal with all the like you don't even know how to like you got a Zoom call with all these remote people you've hired and all that so it's, there's a lot of inherently bad things, but there's also kind of just a general mindset shift that needs to happen in companies where it's like we are going to do the hard things and we're going to need to tolerate the the let's just call it pain associated.
12:30: Otherwise you're just kind of like ignoring the problems and I don't know, a world that's optimizing for convenience and comfort of people while companies are are dropping left and right.
12:41: I think it's just not very good.
12:42: All the people that are gonna be left over are gonna like lose their jobs eventually if the companies don't recover.
12:46: So I don't know, it's, it's a kind of a bleak view, but I also see companies doing whatever it takes to solve it.
12:52: , it's just hard, it's hard.
12:53: You've hired everywhere.
12:55: You have people that are demanding people go into the office that they don't even go to.
12:59: you have managers that don't want to say hard things to people.
13:03: you have people that were promised literally in writing that they would be doing remote jobs.
13:07: So it's, it's not a, it's not a great situation for anyone, but I don't know, it's, it's, we're trying to do our best to kind of make.
13:14: The best of the situation for like experience of people going in, and that's what our product suite it's all like, even when you go to our website, it's all like bright colors, happiness and like we try to promote like, like we tell you, hey, your friends are gonna be coming into the office today and this is you get to pick your food and you get to see like, who's around you.
13:31: So we try to like bring some community and socialness to it, but at the end of the day these need to kind of just be clear as to what they're looking for.
13:38: You're a first-time CEO.
13:40: Now you've been CEO for quite some time.
13:42: 12 years now.
13:44: What, what would you have told first year CEO, you know, first year CEO 11 years ago what you know now?
13:50: I mean, this this could go on for hours, and yeah, I mean, I just generally say.
13:58: You need to hire owners, you need to work with owners.
14:00: You need to work with people that want to be owners.
14:03: that's the most important part of, of, of building a company.
14:07: You're oftentimes pulled into like, oh, we need somebody for marketing or oh we need an engineer so we can get this thing done, or, oh, we need like more support people because we have too many questions and you need to remember that like you're the people are not there to do work, they're there to be owners.
14:20: With you and they're there to think through the problems, not just the problems they're dealing with day to day, but the, the bigger picture problems because I, I think people just like kind of in a world where things change, if somebody was hired to like, I only do content for this kind of thing and now they, there's AI that does it now what do they do?
14:40: So, so there's just something about you need people that can think of.
14:43: What's what's right for a business and what's right for building a mindset with others around what's what's best for the business.
14:51: You had mentioned that you were at Twitter.
14:54: when you were at Twitter, just so I can set the timeline for people, it had just adopted retweets and the first inkling that Osama bin Laden was dead had been linked on Twitter, leaked rather on Twitter.
15:06: , you had integrated, not you personally necessarily, but the iOS 5 was being integrated so that you could share content easily.
15:15: take me back to those days.
15:16: I mean, were the servers just smoking or no, no, no, it was fine it was fine.
15:21: So look, I was, I was, I was super young at the time and it was.
15:26: We would have downtime basically every single day.
15:29: And, and it was kind of, I don't know, I enjoyed it because it's like, hey, like this is real purpose, like every single night, like basically the day work like this.
15:36: You'd get in the office as an engineer at like 10 o'clockish and then you'd be there from 10 to like, I don't know, 6 or 7.
15:43: And then at 7, everybody would get together and, and we would go to like the local bar and then while we were at the local bar, the servers would go.
15:51: Down.
15:51: So then, we would do some kind of fixing there, but then we finally went home to get some kind of sleep.
15:57: But then inevitably at like 3 a.m., we would get a call from Pager duty, which is still around today, and, and it would be like, OK, cool, your servers are still down and it's it's problems.
16:07: So Twitter had a lot of growth.
16:08: There's a lot of, we all said the problem where like Japan was really into Twitter.
16:12: So, so they were using it when we were sleeping and a lot of our load related.
16:16: Issues were also triggered there, but, I mean, look, yes, you lose sleep.
16:21: Yes, it's frustrating for a lot of people as babies crying in the background.
16:24: There's wives screaming at people.
16:26: It's not always wonderful, but for somebody like me who was just like, just excited about the startup thing, it was, it was exciting and, and we fixed it as best we could, and, and eventually we got to the spot where we could actually start building out a head of Where our current problems were, and I don't know, it was a real, it was the real deal.
16:45: I really enjoyed it.
16:46: I think a lot of people did not, but I really loved it.
16:48: Now a lot has changed since then ownership name, I mean, a lot has changed, but you haven't used it since I was looking in July.
16:56: I used it.
16:56: I used it a couple of days ago.
16:58: No, it's so I, I read it every single day all the time.
17:03: I, I post here and there.
17:05: I go through.
17:05: sprints of it, like I'll have like months at a time where I'll go crazy and then I'll go quiet again.
17:11: I don't know, it's just like it depends.
17:13: It's one of the things, one of the rules I set for myself is I'm never allowed to complain on Twitter and it's very, very hard to use Twitter when you're not complaining on it.
17:21: I can't tell you the number of tweets I have written but never sent.
17:24: I mean, good on you for not sending them, and it's, it's really tough, like, especially these days, I, I just hope they you get like they somehow make that service and I think I've tuned it enough now where when I read my timeline, I don't just get angry the entire time.
17:40: So that's good.
17:40: I've also tuned my Reddit stuff too, so like both of them are pretty solid now, but it takes a lot of, a lot of blocking of people and a lot of just like, on Twitter at least you have like the filter word stuff so that that helps, but yeah, yeah.
17:55: Yeah, yeah, I, I agree.
17:58: as for Google, you started at Google at 16, it's like interviewed at 17, yeah, well, it's there's like some legalities here but like.
18:11: I started working.
18:12: You started at Google at the appropriate time that is legal under California law.
18:17: That's right.
18:17: Remember how all these people go to jail?
18:19: Yeah, this is one of those things they bring up afterwards.
18:22: So at whatever age it was, and let's say it was 17, you started at Google, When I was talking to you on a television interview, I compared it to Doogie Howser and then got the sense you don't know who Doogie Howard I I actually forgot now that's yes, correct.
18:39: So, you were young in a place with young people in it, but you were still very young.
18:47: I was one of the youngest, there's some other kid that was younger than I was and I was upset at that.
18:51: Look, it's like 17 year olds are going to be upset over the dumbest things and I think there was like a 16 year old that somehow got the fast track in.
19:00: , but it's, it's, it's, no, it, it was fun.
19:05: It was fun.
19:05: I was surrounded by, by geniuses and it was, it was wonderful.
19:09: I could not have asked for a better way to kind of start a career, let's call it, but it's, yeah, it was, it was really cool.
19:16: That was also like really good days to like Google was on the up and up, people weren't upset about privacy about everything.
19:23: there wasn't, all that drama, so it was, there's still privacy stuff.
19:27: It was minor, minor at best, so it was mostly like, wow, we're actually changing the world.
19:31: People are actually finding stuff better.
19:32: We're actually helping as opposed to having that but also having this massive layer of hate on top.
19:37: So I, it's, it seems like every company has that these days and you get to get good at filter around that, but that's the second time you mentioned, you know, that people get upset or is any of it directed at you?
19:48: I mean, you run a company that you know, that helps people in offices.
19:51: Yeah, yeah, no, oh.
19:53: Oh, interesting.
19:54: no, not really with envoy.
19:55: I, I think for whatever reason people don't really look at us as like facilitating their return that they don't want to do.
20:03: so it's been, I was surprised I actually thought we get more kind of just attention on that.
20:08: at the end of the day, the companies are the ones setting up the policies and and they're actually bringing us in to make it less bad.
20:14: So I'm I'm not gonna get mad at my key card for yeah, for like requiring you to, yeah, exactly, no, it's a good way of putting it, Yeah, so that's nice, but I don't know, I just think people are upset about a lot of things these days, so I try, I'm somebody who tries to keep pretty positive on things, but even people that are, are, are trying to be positive are are going to get down if if they're surrounded by too much negativity.
20:34: So you got to like really actively filter it.
20:36: You know who Doogie Howser was, but you know Ted Lasso.
20:40: OK.
20:40: I always thought that was the the secret sauce of Ted Lasso is if you want go back and watch it now, it's it's a perfectly fine TV show.
20:47: But it it was happiness and family and understanding in the exact right moment during the pandemic and the panic and everything else looking for those sorts of let's let's let's just feel better about each other.
21:02: Yeah, yeah, I think it's like that's I wish people were more intentional about that like it's it's just it's it's just.
21:09: Seems that, yeah, I, I wish people were more intentionally trying to be positive about things.
21:13: I think it's, it's very easy and very instinctive to, to just be negative about stuff and and and it clearly spreads faster, but, I, I, I wish people would just be like just try really hard to be more positive.
21:26: You grew up in Romania and then lived in Germany, Canada and the United States.
21:32: your mom was a house cleaner in in Germany, you know, was she an undocumented?
21:38: Yeah, my dad, he was picking berries.
21:40: It's great.
21:41: OK, so you are the, you know, the son of two undocumented immigrants, that's one way of putting it.
21:47: Yeah, yeah, they were in Germany.
21:49: It was like.
21:49: short period also I like how we're always having to like say, well, you know, the like some factors, maybe it was like you know, go with me on the idea that you are the son of two undocumented workers and undocumented workers who are doing housecleaning and agriculture.
22:08: Yeah, I mean, they're working.
22:09: these are very common jobs for immigrants in America.
22:13: , does it, does it shape the way that you see all the, the debate over immigration?
22:19: , my general view is, it's just like, look, I, I, I'm somebody who believes in hard work is, is the key to most success.
22:29: a day doesn't go by where I'm not stressed out or like, doing something that's like very, very tough and difficult.
22:35: I think a lot of people.
22:36: We have a way of thinking that CEOs just like live this glamorous life.
22:40: but look, I, I was in there at 7 a.m. this morning doing some kind of reference call.
22:45: I had to get like a whole bunch of meetings and now I'm over here.
22:48: I'm gonna go right back and like we got a whole bunch more work and it's a Friday, by the way, this is like it's, it's, yeah, it's a Friday.
22:55: I'm going to the office like it's, it's just, it's never easy and You just got to kind of like deal with that, so I, I feel like the upbringing that I got from them was just one of like hard work equals success and look, I know that for some people maybe in the world it doesn't, but I think that that's the best way to kind of favor the odds.
23:12: Yeah, it's it's the way you ought to try.
23:15: Yeah, it's the best shot.
23:16: Like if you're kind of like you don't know what to do and it's like that kind of thing, I, I think hard work is the best way to influence the odds.
23:22: And then you came from Canada, I assume it was Google that got you to America.
23:26: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
23:26: So I, I grew up mostly in Canada like I think I was like 3 years old or something, when, when I went to Canada, and then basically grew up there and and went to school and everything in there too.
23:39: So, you told, the CEO podcast that you have a lot of money in crypto, but you also think it's a farce.
23:46: , yeah, yeah, it's probably like all gone now too, but I, I hope it's still there.
23:51: I mean, I don't sell it, it's just still there, but it's it's a little, it's a little funny like, look, I, I, I, I have a a a very strong appreciation for the SEC just given how crazy the cryptoland got like it's just literally you have pumping.
24:08: Dump schemes that are like in the open and everyone knows it's happening, but people are just like kind of cool with it and and it's it's like you can see why regulations got created so it it kind of feels like the wild west or something, but before the wild west, so it's, I don't know, yeah, it's a little, it's a little wild crypto crypto's interesting.
24:29: I think there's a lot of cool innovations there, still seems to be very financially driven, versus like inherent value in a lot of ways, but, And it seems a little too tied to the American economy as well, which is kind of one of the promises that's that's what it's supposed to be, yeah, but it's fun.
24:46: I don't know, they got these unicorns and like rainbows and stuff and like I'd like to see that come from like the treasury, so it's kind of like, well, it's a lightheartedness when the Secretary of the Treasury ever say to the moon, right?
24:59: Yeah, yeah, no, they don't say that.
25:00: They don't say that.
25:00: They certainly don't say it with Lambes and all that stuff, but it's a light-heartedness.
25:04: I know a lot of people are.
25:06: They're making or losing a lot of money on it and that kind of thing too.
25:08: I think it's important to keep like keep just like, hey, this is like a fun thing people are doing.
25:15: now I know there's like serious transactions happening and there's some really good smart institutional investors that are tied to it, but it's I just I I I'd like to see more value that's like inherent to the distributed ledger, because it just seems like centralized companies still are able to get along very well.
25:34: Yeah, I would, I would agree with you that my position is blockchain makes a lot of sense to me, the ledger makes a lot of sense to me.
25:41: Dogecoin does not.
25:44: I'm, I'm staying, I'm staying away from all of it.
25:47: you have been described as an engineer through and through.
25:50: What, what evidence, you know, tell me what is the phrase, tell me or show me you're an engineer without telling me sort of thing.
25:56: What, what about you as an engineer through and through?
25:59: Well, oh boy, I mean, I, I would just generally say I I.
26:03: Over analyze everything.
26:04: I'd like to understand the why behind things.
26:07: I think engineers generally want to understand how something works so they can make it better.
26:12: my day to day is just spent trying to optimize, trying to figure out efficiencies in the company, trying to figure out like how can we do something better, even if it is working.
26:21: So that's the, that's the engineer part in me I guess.
26:25: I mean, also look, like I, I built a company around the internal operations of companies like that's, that's something my before that I was a systems a back end systems engineer, at, at Twitter and then before that at Google and it was like those are very like behind the scenes kind of roles, but it's, it's.
26:45: I just enjoy how stuff works and optimizing it.
26:48: You've been, you know, an engineer type since you were a little kid, I suppose all engineers are.
26:52: You had a Pokémon website at what age?
26:55: That that was OK, so I think I was like 11, I was 99, I think so.
27:00: I joked that that's my, that's my like dotcom boom website.
27:07: It was me and my brother, we made this website.
27:09: Pics world of Pikachu and it was just a whole bunch of like copyrighted pictures of Pikachu and back then they didn't crack down because it's fan art, so it's fine.
27:18: But that was pretty cool.
27:20: I made like $60 or something off of it, and I got a free domain name out of it.
27:25: So the domain name was like, oh, that's really cool.
27:27: I got a dotcom.
27:28: This is neat.
27:29: So I had a literal.com back in 20 or 1999, which is, which is fun.
27:34: Is, can you remember a time before that that you said, oh yeah, that was when I was going to be an engineer.
27:40: I mean, look, I, I've had, I mean when I was there's a story here somewhere around when I was like 7 or 8, I was like playing with Cuba.
27:47: I I just spend the entire time, even in school, like we obviously didn't have laptops or phones or anything, so I just write on pieces of paper like code that then at the end of the day I just write on my computer and and it was all like simple.
28:01: stuff that like a kid would do is like little games and stuff, but it's just kids have an unreasonable ability to not get bored of writing and doing things so it's it was it was fun and and then I do it at home and my parents would always be concerned that I'd be playing on the computer.
28:18: It's like, no, no, it's my own thing.
28:19: It's like is it playing if I made it, and that's that's I get grounded in my room where the computers there so it's kind of like what's so bad about that.
28:28: , at one point they caught on, but it's, it's, is it playing if it's your own game?
28:34: Mhm.
28:37: Larry Gadilla, CEO at Envoy funded by Andreessen, Menlo Ventures, and Initialized Capital among others.
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